OLD LYME PLANNING COMMISSION
PUBLIC HEARING & REGULAR MEETING
JANUARY 10, 2008
PRESENT WERE: Harold Thompson, Robert McCarthy, Steve Ross, Connie Kastelowitz, Chris Kerr and Alternates Robert Pierson and Nancy Strohla. Also present were: Kim Groves, Darcy Collins, Michael Cronin, Tony Hendriks, Dick Gates and other members of the public.
PUBLIC HEARINGS
SUBDIVISION – ENOK PEDERSEN – 17 LOTS BURR ROAD
Attorney Michael Cronin was present on behalf of the applicant, Enok Pedersen. Cronin noted that the commission is very familiar with this application because it has been before the commission both informally and formally for at least two or three years. He noted the last time the application was before the commission was about ten months ago. He stated at that time the application reached the point of requesting action by the commission, but Mr. Metcalf submitted a report which included a concern of whether or not the storm water discharge over the disturbed areas of the site including the roadway was acceptable from an engineering point of view. Cronin stated the proposal was for the water to be handled on site on each of the individual lots as opposed to being put into a drainage system. Cronin stated because of the drainage issue the applicant withdrew the application in order to address these concerns. He further stated the two items that were not complete at that time
that were essential to implement Mr. Metcalf’s recommendation was to get permission to improve and expand two culverts. Cronin stated one of the culverts was located on Saunders Hill Road and the other was located on Saunders Hollow Road. Cronin stated this had been addressed by filing an application and receiving approval of the application from the Inland/Wetlands Commission. Cronin submitted a copy of the wetland reports to the commission for the record.
Darcy Collins, Professional Engineer, was present from the firm of Doane-Collins Associates on behalf of the applicant. Collins requested that the commission incorporate the record from the old public hearing into the current public hearing. The commission agreed to do so. Collins stated that the property is 87.36 acres located on Burr Road and the proposal is for a 17 lot subdivision in the RU-80 district. She noted there is an existing house on the site. She stated two roadways would access the site. She indicated the total road lengths are 1,800 ft. and 1,100 ft. for a total 3.46 acres. She indicated the lots range in size from 2 to 4 acres and include 6 rear lots and three common driveways. She stated there is 26.91acres in deeded open space and there is 34.54
acres in conservation easements, which brings the total open space on the site to 61.45 acres, which is approximately 70% of the entire site area. Collins noted the site has been reviewed and approved by the town sanitarian and reported that the utilities will be located underground. She indicated there is a small watershed to the north of the site that will be picked up by the road drainage system and discharged into a sub-area and the remainder will be discharged into a detention storm water quality basin. Collins also noted that there are two off-site drainage improvements. She indicated that one is located on Saunders Hill Road where an existing undersized culvert will be replaced with an appropriately sized culvert for a 25 year storm. She stated also the culvert on Saunders Hollow Road will be replaced with an appropriately sized culvert. She further noted that the culverts have been approved by the town engineer.
Page 2 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
Collins noted there is an increase in flow from the site of approximately 6 percent, but it is accommodated with the culverts. She also noted a fire tank is proposed on Lot #4 at the recommendation of the Fire Department. She indicated that Mr. Doane had looked into the possibility of drafting from Mr. Pedersen’s pond in this area but the elevations did not work out so therefore a 30,000 gallon fire tank was added to the proposal. Collins indicated the review comments received from both Ann Brown and Tom Metcalf have been addressed on the plan. Collins did note that the “Record Subdivision Plan” did not show the correct conservation plans therefore she submitted revised plans.
Thompson asked if these plans were different than those approved by the Wetlands Commission.
Cronin submitted a sample conservation easement to the commission. He also noted he would be forwarding documents to Attorney Cassella for his review.
Chris Kerr asked if there was any possibility of providing a ramp to the pond to avoid the installation of the fire tank. Collins indicated she would follow-up with Mr. Doane. Kerr expressed concern over the long-term maintenance and expense to the town with the fire tank. Cronin noted there was a lot of testimony at the prior hearing on this subject and noted because of the characteristics of the site there were limitations as to what could be done.
McCarthy asked what the status was of the Burr Road and Bill Hill Road intersection. Cronin stated this was also considered at the original public hearing and the commission requested that the applicant approach the Town of Lyme with regard to the intersection. Cronin indicated that they did meet with the Selectmen and an extensive report was made back to the commission on those results. Cronin summarized the action on this matter by stating that the Town of Lyme although cooperative indicated that they did not want to put any town resources into correcting the problem. Cronin also noted there is currently a farm market on the road, which generates a lot of traffic. He stated this commission at that time stated they felt the Town of Lyme should solve its problems rather than look to the
Town of Old Lyme to solve its problems for them.
McCarthy asked if a waiver request had been submitted for the road length. Collins indicated that one has not been submitted but she will submit one for the record at the next meeting. McCarthy noted that the proposed road extends well beyond the acceptable limitations. Collins also noted this was a far more viable option than providing access back out to Burr Road. McCarthy expressed concern about emergency vehicles having access to the house lots. Collins indicated that this road would be constructed to town standards and therefore all emergency vehicles would be able to access this area.
McCarthy asked about the ponding concern expressed by one of the neighbors from the water running down the roadway. Collins indicated a catch basin has been installed in that area.
Ross stated this commission did visit the situation of the intersection. He stated while it is a heavily traveled road at the present time he did not feel that seventeen houses was adding a flood of cars. He stated he felt the Town of Lyme should be approached just one final time given that it is in the public record that citizens of Lyme have expressed concern and that a citizen of Lyme donated land to rectify the situation many years ago. He further stated if something were to happen with that intersection the Town of Lyme is quite vulnerable legally. He stated they are aware of the situation and have the facility to repair it and have not done so. Again he stated it was not a problem for the Town of Old Lyme. He suggested that Lyme be
Page 3 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
reminded once again. Cronin stated he has no problem approaching the Town of Lyme one more time and reporting back to the commission. Ross also stated he in no way feels it is the responsibility of the applicant.
Thompson asked if a parcel history map had been submitted. Collins indicated they would provide one at the next meeting. Thompson asked if the rear lot setbacks had been reviewed. Collins indicated the comments were not received in their office in enough time to be addressed prior to the meeting this evening.
Thompson asked if the MABL has been shown on the individual lots. Collins indicated that they have been shown on each lot however the area still needs to be added.
Thompson asked about the setbacks on Lots 7, 9, 10, & 13. Collins indicated the rear lot setbacks would be checked and she would report back to the commission at their next meeting.
Thompson asked about the drainage on Lot #12. Collins stated she would like input from the commission on the placement of the sediment detention basin. She stated if the commission desired the basin could be incorporated into the open space and still meet the requirements of Lot 12. Collins stated she felt it might be a good idea to remove it from private property and include it in the open space.
Thompson asked about the proposed street lighting on the site. Collins indicated street lighting is shown on the plan, however Mr. Doane would like the commission to review this item. Thompson asked how many lights are proposed. Collins indicated their placement is at the low points of the site. She also noted that CLP dictates what the actually lighting needs to be. Collins pointed out on the map where the two lights were proposed.
Thompson noted for the record that the commission had received a memo from the Conservation Commission with regard to this subdivision.
QUESTIONS FROM THE PUBLIC:
Tony Hendriks addressed the commission on behalf of Harry Clark. Hendriks stated he had spoken at the prior meetings also on Mr. Clark’s behalf. He stated Mr. Clark has expressed great concern about the intersection of Burr Road and Bill Hill Road. Hendriks stated Mr. Clark has no objections to the subdivision, but he has lived there for fifty years and has repeatedly seen interesting auto maneuvers at that intersection. He further stated there has been land set aside to revise that intersection and he would like to see it done and it would also prevent the lighting from directly pointing at his house.
Thompson asked if Mr. Clark lives in Lyme. Hendriks indicated that Mr. Clark owns property in both Lyme and Old Lyme, but the house he lives in is in the Town of Lyme. Kerr asked if Mr. Clark had spoken to the Town of Lyme about his concerns. Hendriks stated Mr. Clark does not feel that it is his jurisdiction to pursue this matter. He further stated Mr. Clark feels it is the developer’s responsibility since he is creating the additional traffic flow.
JUDY BREAULT – BURR ROAD – LYME – (she also is a landowner in the Town of Old Lyme)
She expressed concern about the increase in traffic flow. She stated if there are seventeen houses there is going to be at least four trips in and out a day from each of those homes which is an additional sixty or seventy cars. She further stated that she felt this proposal was a lot for this little road. She further noted this
Page 4 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
has nothing to do with the Farm or anything further up on Bill Hill Road. Breault also expressed concern about the barn owned by Mr. Pedersen and its location on Burr Road. She stated this barn is right up against the road and she does not feel he has any intention of changing that. She further stated she feels this barn is a real hazard.
Breault also expressed concern about the cost to the Town of Old Lyme for the maintenance of the water retention area and if this retention area would increase her taxes. She also noted for the record she was not in favor of the subdivision.
ANN BING
Bing asked if the lights were environmentally friendly. She further indicated there is already a light pollution problem in the area. Collins stated she would provide the details of the lighting at the next meeting.
NANCY MOLL – 5 MANSEWOOD ROAD
Moll asked if a traffic study had been done at the intersection. Collins indicated a traffic report has not been done. She further stated she felt that the traffic from the subdivision was not as much of a problem as the traffic that is being generated from the business down the road. She also noted they would approach the Town of Lyme once again prior to the next meeting.
Collins stated she would also discuss the barn with Mr. Pedersen prior to the next meeting. Collins indicated the basin was not very large and would be part of the normal roadway maintenance. Collins stated because the applicant is increasing the size of the culverts (which is the larger cost) the maintenance of the basin will be insignificant in terms of the Town of Old Lyme maintenance crew time.
Breault stated the IWWC discussed the maintenance of this basin. Collins stated essentially after a storm when the town crews go through to clean the catch basins they will just go down the access road and remove any sediment that is collected in the basin. She stated this is just part of any normal roadway maintenance. Breault stated she was under the impression there would be equipment involved in the cleaning of the basin.
ANN BING
Bing stated she was very disappointed that more green is being eliminated in Old Lyme. She stated we are one of the few towns in the area that does not have a hiking trail longer than 15 minutes.
Collins stated that this subdivision is providing 70 percent of its area as open space. She also noted there is a connection at the rear of Lot #8 to existing open space that could be used for walking purposes.
Steve Ross noted for the record that the town requirements for open space is only 15 percent and this subdivision is more than 4 times the required amount.
Harold Thompson made a motion to continue the Public Hearing until the February meeting. Steve Ross seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
Page 5 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
SUBDIVISION – ROBERT ELY DOUGHERTY – 146 NECK ROAD
Richard Gates, Land Surveyor was present to represent the applicant. Gates presented a parcel history map that demonstrated that the parcel was originally approximately 57 acres in size and in 2003 this parcel was divided into two lots. Gates stated they are proposing to divide the 7 acre parcel in two lots. One of the lots contains an existing house and the remaining lot will be a 3 acre parcel.
Thompson asked about the DOT permit for the driveway. Gates stated the applicant has contacted the DOT and is in the process of obtaining a permit from them. Gates stated if the DOT is not satisfied with the existing driveway it will be relocated further down which would not impact the parcel. Thompson asked about the sight line. Gates stated the maps have been revised to address comments from Wade Thomas of Nathan Jacobsen. Gates pointed out the minor changes and submitted revised maps to the commission.
Groves noted the application had been before the Inland/Wetlands Commission and they had a finding of no jurisdiction on the property.
Harold Thompson made a motion to close the public hearing. Connie Kastelowitz seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
LOT LINE MODIFICATION – LEROY & MICHELLE MERGY – 22 & 30 LYME STREET
Tony Hendriks stated after making a boundary line change once before the applicant has opted to make another boundary line change. He stated the Mergy’s feel that the old parish center would be more appropriately part of the old church property. Hendriks stated the rectory parcel has been reduced it in size. The commission reviewed both the previous and proposed boundary line changes. Hendriks stated that as part of the proposal a portion of the existing outbuilding has to be demolished in order to meet the overall coverage requirements.
Thompson asked if approval had been granted from the State Health Department. Hendriks indicated they had received approval from the Town Sanitarian. Thompson stated Mr. Rose had signed that approval prematurely. McCarthy stated this approval was required because multiple buildings were being tied into one septic.
Thompson stated he would be willing to grant an approval based on the receipt of approval from the State. Ross stated the property owner would not be able to get a Certificate of Occupancy without that approval. Thompson stated the owner already received approval from Mr. Rose. Ross asked if that was an error. Thompson indicated that was correct. Ross stated this approval was not required for a lot line modification. Hendriks agreed an approval should be granted from the state. He further noted it was the requirement of the local Health Department to submit the application to the State for approval. Strohla stated she felt it was the responsibility of the commission to make sure all the proper approvals were granted prior to the commission taking action.
Harold Thompson made a motion to approve the application contingent upon receiving approval from the State Health Department and the building must be removed and the monuments set within 120 days and a bond be posted for the amount of $500.00. Connie Kastelowitz seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
Page 6 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
PRELIMINARY DISCUSSION – SUBDIVISION – EDWARD & LINDA MARSH – 7 LOTS – BUTTONBALL ROAD
Darcy Collins stated the proposal is located on the corner of Mile Creek Road and Buttonball Road. She stated the parcel is approximately 53 acres and located in a RU-40 zone. The proposal is for seven new lots with the retention of a 17 acre parcel for the farm making a total of eight lots. She noted one of the lots would be accessed from Buttonball Road and a common driveway would access the remainder of the lots. The proposal includes a 7 acre conservation easement on the Black Hall River.
Thompson asked how the open space was accessed. Collins stated the lots that adjoin the parcel would have access but she stated more details needed to worked out for the remaining lots.
REFERRAL FROM THE ZONING COMMISSION FOR MODIFICATIONS TO THE ZONING REGULATIONS AND ZONING MAP
Chris Kerr expressed concern over the loss of commercial and light industrial zones. Pierson stated he felt there was a danger of becoming a bedroom town. He stated bedroom towns become very tax intensive and the LI-80 zone originally by Zoning use to go from Four Mile River Road all the way down to Whippoorwill Road and over the years it has been reduced back to Flat Rock Hill Road. Pierson stated he felt an appropriate place for these zones was adjacent to I-95. He stated Ann Brown stated at the last meeting that these areas abut residential land. Pierson stated anywhere it is placed it will abut residential land. He further stated if the Zoning Commission has a more appropriate place for these zones and kept an equal acreage but he did not feel Old Lyme should loose that tax base
because this town is already residence heavy.
McCarthy stated he was also in agreement with both Chris Kerr and Robert Pierson. He also expressed concern about some of the parcels that are already developed as either commercial or light industrial, which will place a burden on those property owners when the zone is changed.
Ross stated he also agreed. He stated he did not feel it was a good idea for a Zoning Commission to create non-conformity. Ross stated he felt the Zoning Commission should modify their plan to maintain the same amount of commercial and industrial space as we currently have and to not create non-conforming lots.
The commission agreed to notify the Zoning Commission in writing and request that it be read at the hearing.
Harold Thompson made a motion to write a letter to the commission with a recommendation to not eliminate the LI-80 and Commercial zoning.
READING AND APPROVAL OF THE NOVEMBER MINUTES
Steve Ross made a motion waive the reading and approve the minutes as submitted. Robert McCarthy seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
MEETING CALENDAR
Harold Thompson made a motion to approve the 2008 Planning Commission Meeting Calendar dates. Steve Ross seconded the motion. The motion passed unanimously.
Page 7 – Minutes
January 10, 2008
ELECTION OF OFFICERS
The following members were elected to office for the 2008 Calendar Year: Harold Thompson, Chair; Robert McCarthy, Vice Chair; and Connie Kastelowitz, Secretary.
Respectfully submitted,
Kim Groves
Land Use Administrator
| 
